Does this film have a "message"? If so, what do you think it is? In the film, Mr. Dunn teaches his students about Hegelian dialectics and opposing forces in history. In what way do we see these factors at work within the lives of the characters in the story? What is your opinion of the film's presentation of Dunn's moral leadership? What commentary does the film make about human behavior, society, and moral choices? Typically these teacher movies tend to present a white teacher going into an inner city school to "save" students of color, but this film obliterates that narrative; how do you feel about this retelling? Which character does the "saving"? Feel free to interject any of your own questions into the conversation...
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10 comments:
I think at least one of the film's message is the need for and influence of family. We see where Drey and Mr Dunne are in the lives and how their family situations have been apart of determining this. It seems to me that they have a symbiotic relationship - they both need the other one for things that other people in their lives (and their own selves) are not giving them
From wiki, "the fundamental notion of Hegel's dialectic is that things or ideas have internal contradictions. From Hegel's point of view, analysis or comprehension of a thing or idea reveals that underneath its apparently simple identity or unity is an underlying inner contradiction." I think that this truly describes both Drey and Mr Dunne. They may recognize what is right and what is wrong, but regardless of what they know or hate, they still may do it. They are ripe with contradictions. Drey sees what life with frank will do in her Brother, but still joins frank. Mr Dunne's whole conversation with Frank about staying away from Drey is a contradiction of his own life
Gosh, moral leadership? Hmmm... i think mr dunne is a complete quagmire. There is so much good, yet so much in his life that just has fallen into the dumpster. What he does for Drey is admirable. More than anyone else in her life, Mr Dunne provides a good influence and a push for moral responsibility and betterment of one's life. The humanity of the juxtaposition of this mentorship/friendship/father-daughter relationship, or whatever you want to label what they have, and the train-wreck that is the life of Mr Dunne is quite poignant and intriguing. Just because the life of someone is screwed up does not mean that they cannot inspire another person to rise above themselves and their circumstances
I could keep typing and talking on here, but where's the fun in that... no need for any more of a dissertation than is already here... Needless to say, i really liked this movie
PS: i now like Ryan Gosling
...deal with it
Oh sure! How are the rest of us supposed to measure up now that Jesse is quoting Hegel. It's all down hill from here...
But on a more serious note, I really liked this film a lot, even as dreary as it was (by the time we get to the dead cat on the kitchen floor I was emotionally exhausted; did it die of natural causes or was he too strung out to remember to feed it?) But wow, what a powerful film and like MR said, it is so antithetical to the usual white knight in shining armor who saves the inner city black children with his/her brilliant pedagogy. I was just jokingly recalling in my observation log how amused I was when Mr. Rust told his 11th graders who'd come up with a good answer to his question "You're saving me from disillusionment which at this time of the year is a very, very good thing." I only thought it was funny at the time, but now it makes me think that nothing (except potentially Dray) was saving Mr. Dunne from disillusionment. His parents remind me of Carly Simon's "The way I always heard it should be." And while they drink themselves into a weekly stupor, their son is committing suicide on the installment plan. The plot device about the dialectic is clever and well played out in his life, and wow, what powerful acting by Ryan Gosling, I was really impressed (his acting chops could even give Matthew McConaughey's pecs a run for their money) I always think it is interesting to pay attention to character names (eg. Jack Black's character in the experiential education film "School of Rock" is "Dewey" which I assume is a nod to John Dewey. I'm wondering whether the title character here is referencing John Donne, (prounounced Dunn) the poet who penned (among other death related poems) "Ask not for whom the bell tolls, it tolls for thee."
After such a bleak storyline, I liked the fact, that at least I was able to interpret it as such, that it seemed to end on a slight upward note. I had been fairly sure that one of the two title characters would end up dead in the end, but instead Mr. Dunne combs his hair and shaves which I took as a foreshadowing that he is going to try and clean himself up.
Oh my, the other relationship that weighed heavily on my spirit is Drey's poor mother trying to hold things together and survive while being as good a parent as she can manage, already having had one kid go astray. As a parent that was poignant and difficult to watch. OK, well, I've blathered on long enough. I really enjoyed your perspective Jesse, by the way.
I'm not sure what to say. I honestly like the white hero story line better because you can leave with happy thoughts....but I realize there are a lot of things wrong with the white hero storyline and that life isn't really like that.
I have struggled with the question of moral leadership since watching the film. I have always thought of teachers as role models and the fact that Mr. Dunne was a drug addict, in my mind, didn't make him a role model. Was he able to connect with Drey because of his addiction, or could his involvement have been so much greater, much more positive if he had his “life together”.
Does it matter how a teacher lives his/her life outside of school as long as the children in the classroom are learning?
A lot of questions come up when watching a movie that has so many different things going on that aren't normally shown. We have a main character who is addicted to drugs and yet is supposed to be this role model for the underprivaledged inner city kids. However, the movie shows that students are often the ones that ask the questions that lead to true learning, and can be people the teacher can learn from. The "message" of the movie to me is quite cloudy and im not real sure exactly what the movie is supposed to be telling us. I feel that the movie was good in showing the human side of teachers and adults in general, that they are not these perfect people who dont struggle with anything. Instead Dunn is pictured as a man who is broken and struggling to find his way in life just like his students are. I think that he could be a positive influence for change in their lives as he understands what not to do in life and can help them when they are struggling with difficult decisions. The character that does the "saving" to me is the little girl in the film, even though her relationship with Dunn is a bit creepy at times. I wonder what we are supposed to think of that relationship? What is the director trying to show us or teach us from there interactions, even the inappropriate dancing at the dance? I overall enjoyed the film, but felt that it was not a good example of what to do when teaching, but instead a telling of how common people make mistakes but still try to help people out.
I have to be honest, I've been putting off writing on here all week, because I'm still not sure how I completely view this movie. I have to say that I think it is a good film for the fact that it makes you think. No matter how you viewed Mr Dunne, his character forces you to think about the role of teachers. I agree with Kim - when you decide to be a teacher,you are taking on the responsibility of being a role model. While it may sound cliche that students look up to teachers, I know it is true (especially for middle school children, like the students in this movie). Mr. Dunne's presonal life is clearly in shambles, and it's easy for us to look at him and say he is a terrible role model. However, where do we draw the line? How much of our personal lives as teachers should be open for criticsm?
I did find it a little refreshing to see some of the typically racial roles reversed in this movie. I found myself having much more respect for Frank, a big time drug dealer than Mr. Dunne.
As for who does the saving in this movie, I'm not quite sure. I think Drey is the one to save herself and Mr. Dunne. Then again, maybe she decides to save herself because she sees what has happened to her teacher, and does not want to end up like him. In that case, maybe Dunne indirectly saves Drey. I'll be interested to discuss this in class...maybe you can all help me sort out my conflicting thoughts!
Overall, I think that this movie has an interesting, yet confusing message. I definitely wasn't expecting this type of movie, and I honestly was expecting to see another white hero movie. I have had my moments of loving those types of movies, but this movie really made me think and it took intriguing spins. I feel that the main message of the movie was that anyone can be inspiring, not just those with their "lives together". Even though Mr. Dunn had his issues, he also had his strengths. He seemed to be able to relate extremely well to his students, and they respected him for that. Often as Christians we are too quick to judge and disregard someone because of their personal lives. Although we should not ignore those decisions, it is important to realize that there really can be good in everyone. I know that sounds corny, but it seems to be the underlying message of the movie. In this way, I agree with Jesse when he said that just because someone's life is "screwed up" doesn't mean they cannot inspire someone "to rise above themselves and their circumstances".
My heart broke when Drey found Mr. Dunn in the bathroom. I thought that she would never respect him again, or look up to him. The movie took things in a different direction than I expected however. Drey actually took it upon herself to be there for her teacher, as he did the same for her, which was admirable. I think that both Mr. Dunn and Drey did the "saving" because they obviously needed eachother and were put in eachothers' lives for a reason. This was creepy at times (at the dance), but other than that I could see more of a father-daughter relationship between the two of them.
I believe that the message of this story is that no one is perfect. The teacher works to help his students and rid them of drugs, then feeds his own habit. He wants meaningful relationships, the opposite of his family, but runs his girlfriend away. The girls protector, Frank, is a drug dealer, but is physically there for her more than others. Her mom works a double shift and tries to financially provide for her, but instead winds up unaware of what is going on in her life.
The film appeared to present him as he was, basically good but complicated. The students loved him for making his classes relevant, but the teachers and administrators saw him as a loose cannon due to his continuing problem. Sometimes however, those that do the most good come from outside the box.
In this case I think the saving was mutual. He protected her from Frank and the negative influence he would have on her life, and she worked to save him from a downward spiral. I think it is often too easy for teachers to assume that they have all of the answers and that students can't teach us anything, and this movie obliterated that stereotype.
I found myself cheering for him, even while I watched his downward spiral. The teachers within the normal bounds of teaching were failing the students, so what more damage could he do? He was imperfect, but he helped at least one person in his wake.
I'm not sure that the film does have a definite message. I find myself, much like Kim, liking the other movies better. I don't however agree with the sentiment that those teacher movies present the white teacher as "saving" the student in their inner city schools. Maybe it is just me, but I always saw these movies from the perspective that both groups of people had something to offer and that the teacher learned equally as much from his/her students as they did from them.
As for the moral leadership in the movie, I think that it was significantly lacking. As a teacher you have certain responsibilities.
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